Guiding numbers

The tight sticky movement is very common with this mount and can be corrected easily.   I had the same problem you're describing with the same bad numbers, I now have sub arcsec tracking any time the weather is nice...  I also added the belt drive mod from Rowan, which is common for this mount, that helps a lot too.

There are many videos about how to clean up the HEQ5 on YouTube.  My advice is to watch them, but you won't need to do the full 'hypertune' thing... There is no need (*usually) to spend a bunch of money on bearings, the bearings in mine were excellent quality Swiss bearings.

However, you will discover that the RA and DEC axis are over tightened.   By watching any of the hypertune videos you will learn how it all works and that makes it really easy to loosen things up and get it moving more freely which will help a ton with your guiding.

I am linking one below, this is the one I found to be the most direct, with the fewest naive assumptions... But again.. Just loosen things up a bit and see how you do before spending $150 on new bearings.  Afterwords adjust your lash and such as the video explains... You'll probably be much happier.  I know I was, and I now understand the machine a lot better also.

https://youtu.be/lwZnLkzNQlw

Kurt Van Wagenen:
The tight sticky movement is very common with this mount and can be corrected easily.   I had the same problem you're describing with the same bad numbers, I now have sub arcsec tracking any time the weather is nice...  I also added the belt drive mod from Rowan, which is common for this mount, that helps a lot too.

There are many videos about how to clean up the HEQ5 on YouTube.  My advice is to watch them, but you won't need to do the full 'hypertune' thing... There is no need (*usually) to spend a bunch of money on bearings, the bearings in mine were excellent quality Swiss bearings.

However, you will discover that the RA and DEC axis are over tightened.   By watching any of the hypertune videos you will learn how it all works and that makes it really easy to loosen things up and get it moving more freely which will help a ton with your guiding.

I am linking one below, this is the one I found to be the most direct, with the fewest naive assumptions... But again.. Just loosen things up a bit and see how you do before spending $150 on new bearings.  Afterwords adjust your lash and such as the video explains... You'll probably be much happier.  I know I was, and I now understand the machine a lot better also.

https://youtu.be/lwZnLkzNQlw

Thanks Kurt.

Yes it doesn’t seem to effect my stars at all but I thought I must be doing something wrong. 
I have already got the Rowan belt conversion, I will watch that video.
Thanks again

Chris,
I'm working with the same mount and controller as your setup. Also at the same focal length with my flattener/reducer. Been doing this since end  of Jan/23, no expert, but I can relate what I went through. Out of the box I was getting .5" or worse. I had plenty of stiction in the mount and didn't address it right off. The first thing I did was change my guide scope from the 30mm ZWO to the W.O. 50mm uniguide. That helped greatly. I then started seeing .2x" to .3x" when seeing was good (Bortle 6 or worse backyard). There are two groups when it comes to leveling the mount. Those that give it importance and those that don't. I'm in that first group.  Do not believe the mount bubble level. It is probably wrong. Level your tripod with a torpedo level and then check your mount bubble level. If you find it off, using some sort of tap (common blade screw driver), after leveling the tripod, make the mount bubble level match. Tap up from the bottom (align the eyepiece tray so that a large eyepiece hole sits directly below the bubble level hole). Note: place the blade of the screwdriver to the side up in the hole so that it rests on the plastic bushing surrounding the bubble level and 'baby steps'. I only use the mount level as a check after setting the mount on the tripod to see if I changed anything. I do not have the belt upgrade... yet. I did replace all the bearings with Timken bearings, except for the worm drive bearings. They are SKF. I can now spin the mount, RA and DEC like a top. Enclosed are a couple of ASIair Plus screen shots from my Samsung phone that I use to control everything. Hope it helps. Bad guiding stinks!

Chris,
I'm working with the same mount and controller as your setup. Also at the same focal length with my flattener/reducer. Been doing this since end  of Jan/23, no expert, but I can relate what I went through. Out of the box I was getting .5" or worse. I had plenty of stiction in the mount and didn't address it right off. The first thing I did was change my guide scope from the 30mm ZWO to the W.O. 50mm uniguide. That helped greatly. I then started seeing .2x" to .3x" when seeing was good (Bortle 6 or worse backyard). There are two groups when it comes to leveling the mount. Those that give it importance and those that don't. I'm in that first group.  Do not believe the mount bubble level. It is probably wrong. Level your tripod with a torpedo level and then check your mount bubble level. If you find it off, using some sort of tap (common blade screw driver), after leveling the tripod, make the mount bubble level match. Tap up from the bottom (align the eyepiece tray so that a large eyepiece hole sits directly below the bubble level hole). Note: place the blade of the screwdriver to the side up in the hole so that it rests on the plastic bushing surrounding the bubble level and 'baby steps'. I only use the mount level as a check after setting the mount on the tripod to see if I changed anything. I do not have the belt upgrade... yet. I did replace all the bearings with Timken bearings, except for the worm drive bearings. They are SKF. I can now spin the mount, RA and DEC like a top. Enclosed are a couple of ASIair Plus screen shots from my Samsung phone that I use to control everything. Hope it helps. Bad guiding stinks!

Wow David, thanks for the reply.

Amazing I think I have a lot to learn.

I always went by the bubble on my tripod. Also your guiding looks awesome, when I say Total error of 5/4 I mean e.g 4.66”. Best I’ve had is 2.85”.

So I’m obviously doing something wrong looking at your guiding results. 
I’m in Bortle 5 West Midlands England. 
I’ve watched a few YouTube videos of re greasing and new bearings but I’m not that confident in taking my mount apart and reassembling it, abit daunting to say the least. 
Next clear night I will concentrate on better polar alignment I’m just to eager to start shooting. 

appreciate the response 
Chris

Chris,
Yeah! Pretty confident that if you level and align correctly, you can get to near 1.xx" or lower in clear skies. Then comes the tweaking. Which polar alignment method are you using? Of the previous three screen shots, the first was before tackling any problems @ .7x" total out of the box. Normally, if I am guiding at anywhere near 1.xx", then I'm ready to fix something or close up shop for the night, which has been rare so far. I see numbers sneak in like 1.xx" when the seeing changes on me (haze rolls in). Also, you mentioned England, haze is a killer on guiding.

Nice one David I’m excited to try it.

erm I’ve never polar aligned using the scope I’ve always used the ASIair. I just click P.A in the app and away I go.
I’m pretty lucky as I can see North East West, only South is abit restricted because of my house. 

Yes England is a pain with weather but I have had some crystal clear nights in the last 4 months since I embarked this journey.

Light nights is the problem for us now as it goes dark about 11:30pm then light about 2/3am. Lucking forward to the winter so I can spend many hours improving.

Thanks Chris.

Chris Addison:

Focal length all set accordingly (430mm).
Thats your guide scope focal length?

No Z73 main scope 430mm 
Guide Scope 30mm 

all checked and checked again.

and your using the focal length of the guide scope in your guiding software(not the 430mm.)The 430 mm of the main scope doesn't come into it,unless you were using an OAG. Sorry have to ask it may just be the way it reads and interpreting this wrong

ive never used an ASI air..

is it not asking for your guide scopes focal length?
Because i doubt very much it is 30.
Is 30 not its aperture?

if your sing 30 as the focal length then this would explain the high error number.

what guide scope do you have?

ive never used an ASI air..

is it not asking for your guide scopes focal length?
Because i doubt very much it is 30.
Is 30 not its aperture?

if your sing 30 as the focal length then this would explain the high error number.

what guide scope do you have?

Wow Daywalker…

I can’t believe it you are spot on I’ve been putting 30mm as my guide scope focal length, when in fact it’s 120mm. 
I have the ZWO 30mm f/4 Mini Guide Scope

What an idiot I am, I was close to dismantling my mount. 

Thank you for your input i would never of come to this conclusion.

Thanks again Chris

Chris Addison:

ive never used an ASI air..

is it not asking for your guide scopes focal length?
Because i doubt very much it is 30.
Is 30 not its aperture?

if your sing 30 as the focal length then this would explain the high error number.

what guide scope do you have?

Wow Daywalker…

I can’t believe it you are spot on I’ve been putting 30mm as my guide scope focal length, when in fact it’s 120mm. 
I have the ZWO 30mm f/4 Mini Guide Scope

What an idiot I am, I was close to dismantling my mount. 

Thank you for your input i would never of come to this conclusion.

Thanks again Chris

We have all been there.Glad it was somthing simple.

Hi @David Lindsay 
Oh yes I’m grateful for all the advice.

luckily the same night I read joes comment it was a clear night so I raced to test it out.

I spent more time on my PA to get better numbers, I also levelled my scope which I’ve never done before (not with the mounts level). 

Here are my Average numbers. I’m very happy with the results. 


Cheers David.
Chris