Need Help With Guiding My AM5 - Forums

Topic starter

Mar 12, 2024

I have a brand new AM5 that I hoped to use for the first-time last night. Sadly, all I got was frustration. Getting my polar alignment was okay, slow because it's a new mount and I am not familiar with the adjustments. My trouble began when I tried get guiding working. Here's my set up:

Main scope & camera: AT72EDII scope with .8 reducer. ASI533MC Pro and I had a L- extreme filter in the filter drawer.
Guide Scope & camera: 30F4 ZWO 30mm guide scope with a ASI120mm - mini camera.

I have used that scope/ guiding set up on my AVX with zero issues for a long time.

Last night no matter what I did the Dec axis would drop after just a few seconds to anywhere between 30" and 110" to the negative side. I changed my exposure down to 1 second and even tried 0.5 seconds. I increased the Gain, tried Binning 2X, changed the Calibration settings to 1000 for the calibration step and 700 for both max Dec Duration and Max RA duration down from 2000. No matter what I tried the Dec would fall and no amount of wait would see it even try to come back. The RA would stay pretty good around 1".

I am at a loss. Any advice or help would be appreciated.

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Jan Erik Vallestad

Mar 12, 2024

This might be a good read: https://bbs.zwoastro.com/d/15989-getting-the-best-performance-from-my-am5

There's a lot of information, but it's good information

GiffS

Topic starter

Mar 12, 2024

Yeah, I have read that and several other threads over on ZWO's forums. I also have posted and read on CN. I tried the suggested "start here" settings from Kevin_A and no joy. What makes no sense to me is that my entire set up including the guide scope and guide camera are being run on a ZWO mount using ZWO's ASIAIR. I got a good polar alignment but still the AM5 won't guide properly. The error was only in Dec and always to the negative. It's got to be something stupid I am doing or forgetting. I have checked that I tightened the levers, so it's not sag, my mount clock reads one hour later than EST which is correct I believe. It slewed to my target perfectly, but it wouldn't guide.

Jan Erik Vallestad

Mar 12, 2024

Ok, I can't remember all my settings exactly but with my OAG and 174mini I run 0.5 exposures, rather high gain, bin 1 and very low aggresion on both RA and DEC (these must be fine tuned as you go), but I'd say start with 10-15% or something. That's what I do at least. The other settings are standard (I believe)

The main point in that thread though is that each mount is different so one setting might not work as well for others despite working well for one.

The one thing I've noticed is, at least with an OAG and my Esprit 100ED, that the guiding is quite sensitive. Much more so than with my old HEQ5 Pro. If I get numbers approaching 0.6"-0.8" without pointing very low on the horizon there's something in the atmosphere affecting seeing, it might be bad seeing or thin clouds. With my old mount those numbers used to be a good sign. Usually though I can guide at 0.25" to 0.35" on a regular basis when conditions are good.

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Dunk

Mar 12, 2024 · Edited: Mar 12, 2024

A friend of mine had a loose bolt on his AM5 (one of the ones you can see when looking through the holes on the side of the mount) - so bad that his whole OTA would drop when it got to a certain point. This was a brand-new AM5. I've heard of this from a couple of people.

I know you said you tightened down the levers - but I would check all the bolts etc. are tight too.

Good luck!

d.

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GiffS

Topic starter

Mar 12, 2024

Thanks Dunk never thought to check those. Will do that tonight.

GiffS

Topic starter

Mar 13, 2024

Success! Sort of. The good news is that I am guiding, the bad news is not that great. Currently getting around 1.15 to 1.65" total. I think that is because I tightened the levers a touch after I finish my PA and just before I set up guiding. I think the problem last night may have been where in the sky I was trying to start guiding. My target was the Soul Nebula and it's not all that far from Polaris right now. I was reading a PHD2 technical document that quite frankly gave me an ice-cream headache. In the author said that when running a mount calibration, it is best to do it at the junction of the Meridian and the Celestial Equator and disaster to run it near Polaris. So, after alignment I slewed to M42 and did an auto focus and then ran a calibration. That did the trick except for me fiddling around tightening levers! I can't run all night tonight so I am shooting 700 10 second exposures of M42 through my new L-Extreme. The difference in the subs between the L-Extreme and my ZWO Duo is astounding.

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GergoB

Mar 13, 2024

Download the guide logs and look at them with PHD2 Viewer. There are plenty of defective AM5's out there, just return it for a replacement while you still can.

Brian Diaz

Mar 13, 2024

hi,

check out the meridian flip is on , the voltage 12v AM5 , be sure that the sync mount is update , start with 50 and 50% dec mode auto guiding .check out all cables and possible Differential flexure. are you using asi air pro plus,

GiffS

Topic starter

Mar 13, 2024

I think the mount is okay. I am making some adjustments to the aggression settings and the exposures to see if I can dial it in better and it seems that I can. Now running around or under 1". For a PA that I know was just oaky I am happy for now. More testing to is needed to be sure but I think it's not the mount as much as it is/was me.

jmdl101

Mar 13, 2024

I have my guiding set at 200ms max duration both Ra and Dec. Ra at 40 or 50 aggression and Dec at 50 to 80 depending on how it's acting. I use 1s guide exposures and typically see under 0.5" RMS all night even with my heavier c9.25. Mine definitely seems to like the super short pulse durations.

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GiffS

Topic starter

Mar 13, 2024

I have my guiding set at 200ms max duration both Ra and Dec. Ra at 40 or 50 aggression and Dec at 50 to 80 depending on how it's acting. I use 1s guide exposures and typically see under 0.5" RMS all night even with my heavier c9.25. Mine definitely seems to like the super short pulse durations.

Thanks I will continue to experiment with various setting to try and dial in a better RMS for my set up. As I mentioned I think I messed up my PA a bit by trying to tighten the levers after I had finished the alignment and slewed to my target. If it’s clear tonight I am going to try to dial in a much more precise polar alignment and then leave it alone and see what results I get. I don’t yet understand the relationship between max duration settings, aggression and exposure times. I’ve got more reading and experimenting to do.

Chris

Mar 13, 2024 · Edited: Mar 13, 2024

If it helps…I too am a new AM5 user (three nights of data so far).

Two sessions ago, My Dec kept dropping…I realized I had accidentally switched the guide settings (right side of the guide graph) to South…I switched it back to Auto and now get good guiding. Total rookie mistake on my part.

Clear skies!

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GiffS

Topic starter

Mar 13, 2024

Thanks Chris I will check that tonight if the weather holds. What really did the trick for me I think was re-calibrating in the right part of the sky. Although my guiding wasn't great last night what I had was very steady which tells me it's my issue and not the equipment's. I need to take a little more care in my polar alignments and tighten the focus on my guide camera. I have a new 220MM Mini on backorder with Agena which will also help a lot I think. Again, thanks for the suggestion I will check it out tonight.

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