PC Guiding & Platesolving Questions - Forums

Topic starter

Jan 25, 2021 · Edited: Jan 25, 2021

First, my equipment and software I currently use:

Imaging: Meade Series 6000 80mm Triplet & Canon EOS Ra
Mount: Sky Watcher EQ6-R Pro (has the USB port)
Guiding: ZWO 30mm f4 Mini Scope & ZWO ASI224mc
Software: PHD2 & Astro Photography Tool (APT) - I have access to Starry Night Pro 7 and it's ASCOM software

I currently guide using the ST-4 connection between my guide camera and the mount. My typical setup is to find polar alignment with the built in polar scope in the mount (I use the PolarFinder phone app for assistance), then do a 3-Star Alignment with the SynScan hand controller, double check my alignment accuracy (usually slew to M45 or another target that is real easy for me to identify without taking a picture) and then go from there. I have had no issues with this once my mount figured out its error corrections in alignment a month or so ago (I have had the equipment since mid-October). However, this weekend I set up, went to the first star in my alignment process with no problem kids needed something real quick, went to go to my second star and the clouds had rolled in and I decided to wait instead of simply canceling my alignment. 15 minutes later was able to finish. I went to realign later because I was worried it wasn't right and then it would not go to the star I told it to. I'm assuming because I had the long pause in my original alignment I messed something up. If someone knows of a fix for this, I'd love to know! Anyways, because of this, I have finally begun thinking of connecting everything to my PC and using it to control the mount, as well as plate solve in APT, but I have no idea where to begin!

Here are my assumptions:
I need to still connect the guide camera to both the PC and the mount (PC with the USB and Mount with the ST-4 cable)
I do not need to connect the hand controller
I connect the mount to the PC with the USB cable (USB from mount to USB to PC)
I need to use the EQMOD driver in PHD2 instead of "On-Camera"
I can now use the connect to Mount feature in ATP
I can use ATP for platesolving but I think I need some other software installed?
I can use ATP to go to a target (Once plate solved), but again, I think I need some other software installed?

I can continue to polar align the way I do or I have heard I can use SharpCap to Polar align, is this possible with my current setup or would I need to buy a polemaster to do this (I am not planning on buying a polemaster and I know my polar alignment and guiding up to this point has been decent enough for me to have no issues with at least up to 5 min long exposures - I haven't tried for longer)

I know this is a lot, and I know the first inclination is to say Google it, but I am looking to see if I can get all the answers from one place from people who I know do it and have troubleshooted problems, etc. Thanks! Also, if anyone has any tips, I'd be more then happy to here them! Clear Skies!

Honeycakehorse

Jan 25, 2021

Hey Jared,

I used to do very similar procedure like you describe and i would like to recommend you an alternative.

- don't use the ST-4 connection
- connect the guide camera directly with your PC via ASCOM
- use a USB Hub like this one ( StarTech.com 7 Port USB 3.0 Hub ) to connect all devices and for example an active usb cable for remote control like this one ( MutecPower 15m USB 2.0 Aktiv )
- deinstall APT and switch to N.I.N.A. ! I know it sucks to get used to new software but it really is much more comfortable
- i love the plate solving N.I.N.A. offers! Simply one click, wait some seconds and it's done. Dont look back.

These were not directly the answers to the questions you asked but i think you should use some new hard -/ software

I'm a bit in a hurry right now but i can try to answer some of your questions more detailed later on..
clear skies,
honeycakehorse

Helpful Supportive

Jeff Ridder

Perfect post

Jan 25, 2021

On the polar alignment, Sharpcap Pro uses your guide cam – no need for a Polemaster. Very simple to use. Simply follow the prompts. It takes one pic in the home (weights down) position, then you rotate (by hand is fine) in RA by 90 degrees. It solves and tells you in real time how to adjust until you're aligned. Well worth the $15 per year.

Well Written Helpful Concise

Jared Holloway

Topic starter

Jan 25, 2021

Jeff Ridder:
On the polar alignment, Sharpcap Pro uses your guide cam -- no need for a Polemaster. Very simple to use. Simply follow the prompts. It takes one pic in the home (weights down) position, then you rotate (by hand is fine) in RA by 90 degrees. It solves and tells you in real time how to adjust until you're aligned. Well worth the $15 per year.

Awesome, thank you!

Jared Holloway

Topic starter

Jan 25, 2021

Honeycakehorse:
I'm a bit in a hurry right now but i can try to answer some of your questions more detailed later on..
clear skies,
honeycakehorse

Thank you for what you have written so far, and I look forward to your additional information!

Well Written Respectful

Padraic Moran

Jan 25, 2021

Agree with most of what has been said before…

- Don't use the ST4 connection
- Don't use the hand controller
- Connect the imaging cam, guidecam and mount by USB to the PC. Use a good quality USB hub for this, as it can be fussy. The Startech mentioned above is a favourite for astrophotographers.
- Use Sharpcap Pro for polar alignment. You don't need to use the built-in polar scope any more, although it can help to get close to Polaris before starting Sharpcap (it needs to be within 6 degrees of Polaris to work - assuming you're Northern Hemisphere!).
- After PA, don't forget to rotate your scope in RA back to home position before turning on your mount.
- No need to do star alignment
- You can use APT or NINA. If you're used to APT, stick with it. I'm moving to NINA at the moment but purely for the autofocus routine, which is definitely better in NINA. Other than that, I don't see any reason to move.
- In APT, take a test image at ~10 secs, plate solve and sync. PlateSolve2 works very well, as does ASTAP.
- I suggest at this point that you Goto++ to a bright star to adjust your focus.
- Now Goto++ to your target star or DSO. APT will automatically slew, plate solve and sync. This process works really well.
- Connect PHD2 for guiding, and off you go.

With NINA, after PA, you just say 'Slew to target' and 'Center target' and it has worked perfectly for me every time so far.

Helpful

Jared Holloway

Topic starter

Jan 25, 2021 · Edited: Jan 25, 2021

Thank you! I think between here and a couple of folks on Twitter I think u habe the gist and should be able to get started. I really appreciate all the advice and help!

Jared Holloway

Topic starter

Jan 25, 2021

Jeff Ridder:
On the polar alignment, Sharpcap Pro uses your guide cam -- no need for a Polemaster. Very simple to use. Simply follow the prompts. It takes one pic in the home (weights down) position, then you rotate (by hand is fine) in RA by 90 degrees. It solves and tells you in real time how to adjust until you're aligned. Well worth the $15 per year.

I may not be able to use SharpCap from my backyard then - 90 degrees in either direction will only show me a house of a tree lol

Jeff Ridder

Perfect post

Jan 25, 2021

Jared Holloway:
Jeff Ridder:
On the polar alignment, Sharpcap Pro uses your guide cam -- no need for a Polemaster. Very simple to use. Simply follow the prompts. It takes one pic in the home (weights down) position, then you rotate (by hand is fine) in RA by 90 degrees. It solves and tells you in real time how to adjust until you're aligned. Well worth the $15 per year.

I may not be able to use SharpCap from my backyard then - 90 degrees in either direction will only show me a house of a tree lol

90 degree RA rotation (no rotation in Dec) should keep Polaris and neighbors in the FOV. As long as you have a clear view of Polaris it should work fine.

Helpful Concise

Honeycakehorse

Jan 25, 2021 · Edited: Jan 25, 2021

Meanwhile, most important points have been mentioned.
Again i would like to strongly recommend the switch to N.I.N.A.
It unites flawless functions in every section.

For the first month of astrophotography i spent countless hours finding bright stars for my 3-Star alignment.
Staring into the sky while freezing my a*ss off, rotating my telescope in every direction and meanwhile, wasting imaging time.
You really don't need that.
Formerly i used APT as well and the plate solve routine was "okay". It did fine most of the time - but sometimes it did not and it took up to 1-2 minutes sometimes.
N.I.N.A. gets the job done in 5 seconds - it's just better and more consistend.

Padraic Moran mentioned another important fact. The Autofocus routine is excellent.
I was used to place and take off the bahtinov mask 10-20 times a night and got really frustrated, interpreting the values in APT Autofocus AID (or whatever it was called...)
N.I.N.A. provides a very good star HFR measurement. Sharp images every time.

Give it a shot!

If you need help setting it up or if you have specific questions, let me know!

clear skies,
honeycakehorse

PS: ahh, in case you don't know yet - there is a major but 'hidden' PHD2 Update -> Multi Star Guiding which improves your values significantly because it can avarage the values of many stars and is not dependent on one star.
You have to download the new developers version ->see this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wDCEjwQNmTE

Helpful Engaging Supportive

Jeff Ridder

Perfect post

Jan 25, 2021

I haven't used APT, but can second the motion for N.I.N.A. I moved to this after fiddling with Ekos on a Raspberry Pi. Too many wasted nights. N.I.N.A. just works. My "at the mount" configuration is an Intel NUC with:

N.I.N.A.
PHD2 with multistar guiding (latest dev release)
ASTAP for local platesolving (usually works)
Astrometry.net for blind platesolving
Sharpcap Pro for Polar Alignment

All works great, unless your sensor frosts up (another thread…

Helpful

Jared Holloway

Topic starter

Jan 25, 2021

Jeff Ridder:
90 degree RA rotation (no rotation in Dec) should keep Polaris and neighbors in the FOV. As long as you have a clear view of Polaris it should work fine.
QUOTE

misread it!! Thanks!!

AwesomeAstro

Jan 25, 2021

In addressing the part of your posting about waiting during the alignment process between stars, I can speak to that for Celestron mounts, although I assume the same applies to your situation.

The mount knows that there is time delay between each alignment star you show it, so it definitely incorporates the movement of the stars between subsequent guide stars in calculating the alignment. However, I have had situations where a long pause between alignment stars creates slightly worse alignments, because this requires very good accuracy in the mount in determining how much the star has moved, and this process is adversely affected by things like periodic error, wobble, etc. So, it's been my experience that aligning relatively quickly is preferred, although not required. If you have a lot of periodic error, then waiting 5-10 minutes between stars could throw things off notably.

Well Written Helpful Respectful

Jared Holloway

Topic starter

Jan 25, 2021

In addressing the part of your posting about waiting during the alignment process between stars, I can speak to that for Celestron mounts, although I assume the same applies to your situation.

I figured this. My 3-star alignment had gotten to the point where it was really, really good. Then this happened haha

AwesomeAstro

Jan 25, 2021

Jared Holloway:
I figured this. My 3-star alignment had gotten to the point where it was really, really good. Then this happened haha

Yup, although I think the mount accounts for the movement (I couldn't imagine any brand not doing so), periodic errors and other problems probably render it relatively inaccurate over a 5-10 minute span.

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